40
40
Feb 15, 2013
02/13
by
MSNBC
tv
eye 40
favorite 0
quote 0
and the final wave from the former joseph ratzinger, the dean of cardinal is now pope benedict xvi. and we thought pope for life. obviously he's writing a new modern history of the catholic church. you can read more of my thoughts about the pope and see a longer version of this flashback on our website. that wraps up this hour of chris "jansing & co." richard lui is coming up next and is in for thomas roberts. >> the difficulty of watching this process throughout that time, the smoke comes out and you have to be able to tell what color it is. >> that was the fourth one. there were four votes and on none of them could we really tell. they all looked gray to us. and i was just reminded, as i was listening to that again, that because the crowd was so loud that when they announced it and it's as clear as can be that they announced that it was joseph ratzinger, we had to wait for somebody on the ground to tell us. we have another one coming up. >> you can feel the energy. i know you can't wait for this one as well. >> the food is good anyway. >> the food is always good. if anyone knows i
and the final wave from the former joseph ratzinger, the dean of cardinal is now pope benedict xvi. and we thought pope for life. obviously he's writing a new modern history of the catholic church. you can read more of my thoughts about the pope and see a longer version of this flashback on our website. that wraps up this hour of chris "jansing & co." richard lui is coming up next and is in for thomas roberts. >> the difficulty of watching this process throughout that time,...
76
76
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
MSNBCW
tv
eye 76
favorite 0
quote 0
i think benedict, joseph ratzinger wanted to be pope last team. he planned to do it. he gave a mark anthony speech. we all heard it during the funeral, which we covered last time. it looks to me like basically he has a 67 voters, majority of voters, in the college of cardinals that he has appointed personally. i think they'll be watching who he wants. if he wants this fellow skoela, he is going to get him. >> it's not the ora of the papacy itself, and you, i think rightfully so, say that the decision could open up a period of soul-searching in the catholic church has, in fact, badly needed. >> right. that point about the most modern thing he did is a quote from michael sean winters, a very smart watcher and student of the catholic church. you know, i was listening to chris, and i think he has the politics broadly right, but this is kind of macciavelli versus the holy spirit here. >> which one? >> exactly. >> i don't represent the holy spirit. i just want to say those are the two views. because he is right. skola is the favorite going in, and the question is are all th
i think benedict, joseph ratzinger wanted to be pope last team. he planned to do it. he gave a mark anthony speech. we all heard it during the funeral, which we covered last time. it looks to me like basically he has a 67 voters, majority of voters, in the college of cardinals that he has appointed personally. i think they'll be watching who he wants. if he wants this fellow skoela, he is going to get him. >> it's not the ora of the papacy itself, and you, i think rightfully so, say that...
170
170
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
KGO
tv
eye 170
favorite 0
quote 0
pope benedict was elected in 2005, formally known as cardinal joseph ratzinger. the vatican will be able to elect a new pope by march because they do not have to observe the traditional mourning time that follows the death of a pope. this is breaking news, just happening, i have reached out to the spokesman for the diocese in san francisco to get a reaction. i have not heard. we will keep trying. stay with us throughout the broadcast. reporting live if san francisco for abc7 news. >> no doubt there will be strock reaction. stay with abc7 for continuing coverage on the resignation of pope benedict xvi, breaking news from overnight with the newest information at abc7 abc7news.co. we will tweet immediate updates on twitter. >> now out the door with a check on the weather forecast. >> any changes from yesterday? >> a few changes. it is cooler this morning. the frost is possible again. here is the radar and the sat light, live doppler 7 hd showing you how dry it is. we will take a look at the temperatures. you will be able to see we are running above frosty levels in
pope benedict was elected in 2005, formally known as cardinal joseph ratzinger. the vatican will be able to elect a new pope by march because they do not have to observe the traditional mourning time that follows the death of a pope. this is breaking news, just happening, i have reached out to the spokesman for the diocese in san francisco to get a reaction. i have not heard. we will keep trying. stay with us throughout the broadcast. reporting live if san francisco for abc7 news. >> no...
289
289
Feb 28, 2013
02/13
by
CNNW
tv
eye 289
favorite 0
quote 0
so cardinal joseph ratzinger seemed an obvious choice. this time there is no such obvious front runner and no simple, single, overriding issue that's driving the reflection, which is why a lot of us believe this conclave may be a little bit more complex and it may take a little bit longer for the cardinals to reach consensus. >> all right. all right, john, let's come back here to new york for a second. melinda, let me ask you, when you're looking at this from the outside, other than the timing which you know i'm completely obsessed with, that's mainly because i have to figure out when i have to get to rome, but when we're looking at what might be different this time, that's the excitement, right? what are you looking at from the outside? what do you think the possibilities here are? and are we being too excited? >> in terms of the candidates or in terms of what we're going to see going forward? >> because pope benedict has created precedent here by saying i'm resigning, this is the best thing for the church, will that idea, what's best fo
so cardinal joseph ratzinger seemed an obvious choice. this time there is no such obvious front runner and no simple, single, overriding issue that's driving the reflection, which is why a lot of us believe this conclave may be a little bit more complex and it may take a little bit longer for the cardinals to reach consensus. >> all right. all right, john, let's come back here to new york for a second. melinda, let me ask you, when you're looking at this from the outside, other than the...
247
247
Feb 27, 2013
02/13
by
CNNW
tv
eye 247
favorite 0
quote 0
one was the american cardinal and joseph ratzinger you may have heard of who became benedict xvi. this time you have 50 conclave veterans in the sistine chapel, and i think therefore will be more inclined to think they ought to have say in what's happening. >> and i believe some 67 who have been elevated to cardinal by benedict xvi. >> that's right. all 115 were appointed by john paul or benedict. >> so as catholics around the world look to the possible direction the church might take, and in america we know there's a big wing of the roman catholics who is looking for a more progressive, more modern catholic church, that addresses the real issues of living in today's 21st century world, other parts of the word are much more traditional, much more conservative model. how do you see it going forward and to you think there will be an american pope for the first time? >> an american pope is a long shot, but for the first time it's thinkable. in the old idea you couldn't have a super power pope because america is too powerful and if you put that guy in, half the world will think vatica
one was the american cardinal and joseph ratzinger you may have heard of who became benedict xvi. this time you have 50 conclave veterans in the sistine chapel, and i think therefore will be more inclined to think they ought to have say in what's happening. >> and i believe some 67 who have been elevated to cardinal by benedict xvi. >> that's right. all 115 were appointed by john paul or benedict. >> so as catholics around the world look to the possible direction the church...
190
190
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
KPIX
tv
eye 190
favorite 0
quote 0
joseph ratzinger came pope when cardinals chose him to succeed pope john paul
joseph ratzinger came pope when cardinals chose him to succeed pope john paul
131
131
Feb 28, 2013
02/13
by
MSNBCW
tv
eye 131
favorite 0
quote 0
behind those walls, behind those gaets now, pope emeritus, the former joseph ratzinger and we have the seat is vacant. the seat of peter is now vacant. father bartuni krc, your feelin? >> the feelings i've had all day. i'm feeming more. bitt bittersweet. nice to see how the decision of the pope is taken by the catholic faithful throughout the world. following what he believes to be the good for the church and many of us have come to really love him and respect him. and so, you really feel it. i mean, at this moment. well, there you go. at the same time, when you see the -- when you see the swiss guards kind of ending their duty for the time being, i can't help but thinking of the whole history of the papacy. they're a personal guard of the pope because the pope is attacked before. the vatican has been attacked in the 20 centuries of church. even though there's surprises in the past, the schurch is still here and god is still working through the church and so i feel a lot of hope, as well. kind of excitement about what might -- what the next couple of weeks might bring. >> we see the th
behind those walls, behind those gaets now, pope emeritus, the former joseph ratzinger and we have the seat is vacant. the seat of peter is now vacant. father bartuni krc, your feelin? >> the feelings i've had all day. i'm feeming more. bitt bittersweet. nice to see how the decision of the pope is taken by the catholic faithful throughout the world. following what he believes to be the good for the church and many of us have come to really love him and respect him. and so, you really feel...
143
143
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
KTVU
tv
eye 143
favorite 0
quote 0
pope benedict xvi was born in 1927 as joseph ratzinger. he served in the army but deserted and was eventually captured by americans and then released. his decision sets the stage for a new pope to be elected before the end of march. the san francisco archdiocese just opened about a minute ago. we are hoping to speak to someone from there and get reaction on this event. >> all right. tara, you can get more information about the surprise resignation announcement about the pope by going to ktvu.com. click on the pope resigns tab. >>> 8:01. police in san mateo, warning residents about an increase in residential burglaries. the police say several burglaries have been reported in the fiesta gardens and shoreview neighborhoods of san mateo in recent weeks. most of them have been happening during the daytime when people are at work. the thieves usually 0 knock on the -- knock on the door first to find out if anyone is home. police are telling residents lock all of your windows and the doors. >>> a crash in concord left one man with life-threatenin
pope benedict xvi was born in 1927 as joseph ratzinger. he served in the army but deserted and was eventually captured by americans and then released. his decision sets the stage for a new pope to be elected before the end of march. the san francisco archdiocese just opened about a minute ago. we are hoping to speak to someone from there and get reaction on this event. >> all right. tara, you can get more information about the surprise resignation announcement about the pope by going to...
125
125
Feb 28, 2013
02/13
by
FOXNEWSW
tv
eye 125
favorite 0
quote 0
joseph ratzinger, pope benedict xvi, coming out to the balcony, and perhaps saying the last public words we will ever hear from him. what did he say? he said, i love you. he said i feel your support. he said, thank you for being here. and then in a very simple way, maybe the last words we'll hear from him, he said, [speaking italian] he said good night, good evening. he turned around and walked in. one of the beautiful signs written there in italian, that i saw in the crowd said, it said, benedict, your humility has made you bigger. and that was humility. there is no more pope benedict xvi speaking to us from balconies or around the world. he is now living as a monk. jenna: father jonathan, even though i'm not able to see you here from washington, d.c., we're still taking in the sights of this square there. we can feel in your voice how moved you are by what has transpired over the last hour. just talk us through a little bit what you're feeling and the emotions that come to mind. >> well, maybe it's better that you don't see me in that, you know, all of us i think, who have known him, a
joseph ratzinger, pope benedict xvi, coming out to the balcony, and perhaps saying the last public words we will ever hear from him. what did he say? he said, i love you. he said i feel your support. he said, thank you for being here. and then in a very simple way, maybe the last words we'll hear from him, he said, [speaking italian] he said good night, good evening. he turned around and walked in. one of the beautiful signs written there in italian, that i saw in the crowd said, it said,...
53
53
Feb 17, 2013
02/13
by
MSNBC
tv
eye 53
favorite 0
quote 0
. >> reporter: as cardinals joseph ratzinger, he was labelled god's rottweiler. he was shown a gentle side. never more so than meeting with sex abuse victims in his 2008 trip in the u.s. he saved his biggest surprise for last says john thamus who covered the vatican for 30 years. >> he will be remembered as the pope who resigned. it will be greatest gift to the church. >> reporter: currently, the conclave to elect the successor to benedict xvi is to happen between march 15th and march 20th. there is talk of moving that date up. all of the cardinals are expected to be here on february 28th. alex, back to you. >>> anne thompson, thank you. the blame game on tsequestratio. the new york times says those will cut 14,000 teachers and employees. and 250,000 civilians employed by the army could be furloughed for up to 22 days. aircraft would forego maintenance. >> it's the president who proposed this sequester. is the house with smarter cuts in other areas of government. >> the fact is this was never the president's idea. this was the result of hostage politics in the re
. >> reporter: as cardinals joseph ratzinger, he was labelled god's rottweiler. he was shown a gentle side. never more so than meeting with sex abuse victims in his 2008 trip in the u.s. he saved his biggest surprise for last says john thamus who covered the vatican for 30 years. >> he will be remembered as the pope who resigned. it will be greatest gift to the church. >> reporter: currently, the conclave to elect the successor to benedict xvi is to happen between march 15th...
144
144
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
MSNBC
tv
eye 144
favorite 0
quote 0
. >> joseph ratzinger, cardinal ratzinger then was 78 years old when he got this job and was actually looking at retirement. he was ready to step down. >> right. >> but obviously the vatican calls -- >> he was moving to boca. hey, how do you know, mika brzezinski, that your church, the catholic church, is in serious, serious trouble? >> how? >> when mike barnicle is speaking. when he becomes -- >> when i'm at the pope desk. >> when he's at the pope desk. where is pat buchanan? hey, somebody call pat buchanan and wake him up. what's up next? >>> well, we're going to talk about the state of the union next. coming up, deputy majority whip congressman tom cole will join us. also former deputy campaign manager for the obama campaign, stephanie cutter will be here to preview the president's state of the union address. and later, we'll talk to nbc news chief white house correspondent, chuck todd. and "new york times" columnist gail collins. and in just a few minutes, sports columnist for the "new york daily news," mike lupica joins the table. he knows it's true. look at him, he looks guilty.
. >> joseph ratzinger, cardinal ratzinger then was 78 years old when he got this job and was actually looking at retirement. he was ready to step down. >> right. >> but obviously the vatican calls -- >> he was moving to boca. hey, how do you know, mika brzezinski, that your church, the catholic church, is in serious, serious trouble? >> how? >> when mike barnicle is speaking. when he becomes -- >> when i'm at the pope desk. >> when he's at the...
212
212
Feb 28, 2013
02/13
by
CNNW
tv
eye 212
favorite 0
quote 0
ratzinger was the last time around. but there are perhaps two or three figures one could say are the next tier down. cardinal angelo shokoal, cardin mark willet, who runs the power for bishops, a deeply spiritual figure and perhaps leonardo sandri, a career vatican official a man that brings the first world and the third world together. we shall see if one of those guys breaks through. >> reporter: indeed and, of course, there may even be a cardinal from the third world, the developing world, who might be elevated. we're going to interview the american cardinal timothy dolan in a few hours from now. we'll have that live on cnn and he's used an awful lot of colorful language to insist he's not the next pope. but his name is constantly cropping up as well. soledad? >> we're already taking bets on who the next successor will be, i'm not surprised about that, guys, thank you. pope benedict xvi will be staying at the picturesque castel gandolfo, southeast of rome. it's a small castle thtle and b anderson is there for us now.
ratzinger was the last time around. but there are perhaps two or three figures one could say are the next tier down. cardinal angelo shokoal, cardin mark willet, who runs the power for bishops, a deeply spiritual figure and perhaps leonardo sandri, a career vatican official a man that brings the first world and the third world together. we shall see if one of those guys breaks through. >> reporter: indeed and, of course, there may even be a cardinal from the third world, the developing...
364
364
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
KGO
tv
eye 364
favorite 0
quote 0
when john paul died, we knew that joseph ratzinger who became pope benedict xvi, he was a very powerful man in the vatican the pope's enforcer in some ways. we all knew his name. we don't really know the names of any of these people now. but, so it's going to be a much more diverse, i think, selection process. >> what are the chances that we'll see a pope from central america or africa? >> it will tough to do that. majority of the catholics are in the southern hemisphere. growing church in africa and latin america. it would make a lot of sense to do that. i think it would be pretty hard to wrestle the power away from europe especially the italians. >> all right, it will be a really interesting couple of weeks. cokie, thank you so much. >>> elizabeth thanks. now to the other big headlines. the extreme weather slamming the country. tornadoes tearing across the country. sam is tracking it all. two blizzards. a real round of severe storms. we'll start with the pictures out of minnesota. it was the sunday blizzard. not the friday one. the one in the middle of country that put anywhere from 1
when john paul died, we knew that joseph ratzinger who became pope benedict xvi, he was a very powerful man in the vatican the pope's enforcer in some ways. we all knew his name. we don't really know the names of any of these people now. but, so it's going to be a much more diverse, i think, selection process. >> what are the chances that we'll see a pope from central america or africa? >> it will tough to do that. majority of the catholics are in the southern hemisphere. growing...
113
113
Feb 12, 2013
02/13
by
WMAR
tv
eye 113
favorite 0
quote 0
take his old name, joseph ratzinger. will he be able to counsel the next pope? >> well, if the next pope would like it, i'm sure he could. however, if -- some people have suggested, wait a minute. you're going to have two popes at work. that's not true. the pope is retiring because he wants to retire. if he wanted to have influence on the church still, he would stay as pope. i would expect very much -- the fact he's going to a monastery -- will be living in a monastery is significant. he wants a quiet life of study and of prayer. if the new pope wants to ask his counsel, he's clearly going to give it. but he's not going to go -- he's not going to be there looking to try to influence the next pope. >> and the new -- the cardinals will be meeting right after the pope resigns on february 28th at 8:00 p.m. will the deliberations about the next pope begin immediately? >> they could begin. we'll find out that in the next few days. they could technically begin as early as the day after, as early as march 1st. but you have to remember, it's never the conclave, which beg
take his old name, joseph ratzinger. will he be able to counsel the next pope? >> well, if the next pope would like it, i'm sure he could. however, if -- some people have suggested, wait a minute. you're going to have two popes at work. that's not true. the pope is retiring because he wants to retire. if he wanted to have influence on the church still, he would stay as pope. i would expect very much -- the fact he's going to a monastery -- will be living in a monastery is significant. he...
262
262
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
WRC
tv
eye 262
favorite 0
quote 0
born joseph ratzinger, he was an academic, planned to retire and write books. some criticize him as a cardinal for becoming too strict. for which he apologized. >> i express my deep sorrow to the innocent victims of this inspeakable crimes. >> reporter: during his eight years as pope, he has taken on major issues, speaking of environmental climate change, putting solar panels on the vatican. he will be pope until exactly 7:00 pm on the 28th of this month. he will eventually move into a residence in the vatican. the vatican is saying they hope to elect a new pope by the end of march before easter. according to church rules, this pope will not be able to vote for his successor because he is over the age of 80. natalie? >> michelle kosinski, following the breaking news for us. thank you. >>> los angeles police department is hoping that a $1 million reward will lead to new clues in the search for former cop christopher dorner, who is suspected of killing a police officer and a couple engaged to be married. in surveillance video obtained by nbc news, sources say dor
born joseph ratzinger, he was an academic, planned to retire and write books. some criticize him as a cardinal for becoming too strict. for which he apologized. >> i express my deep sorrow to the innocent victims of this inspeakable crimes. >> reporter: during his eight years as pope, he has taken on major issues, speaking of environmental climate change, putting solar panels on the vatican. he will be pope until exactly 7:00 pm on the 28th of this month. he will eventually move...
710
710
Feb 28, 2013
02/13
by
KNTV
tv
eye 710
favorite 0
quote 0
and joseph ratzinger was just a professor. he got better at it. people embraced him for what he was. george was mentioning the humility. he didn't have body language, but they saw by his nonbody language, his humility. you always sensed he was surprised that all these people had shown up for me. people grabbed that. they realized that. and i think for that reason, they were also willing to listen to him. >> we see now, matt, of course, the helicopter that will take the pope to his place of residence the next couple of months, castel gandolfo. >> and he won't be alone in the helicopter, father bearron, thee are aides flying with him? >> and the monsignor just in recent weeks names as archbishop and acting as pope benedict's private secretary. he's been a major player in the life of pope benedict. we should also mention that once he arrives at gandolfo, he's expected to be greeted by the mayor of that city. as well as many of its residents. i think they're expecting as many as 8,000 people, to try to get a glimpse of this pope who is not yet the for
and joseph ratzinger was just a professor. he got better at it. people embraced him for what he was. george was mentioning the humility. he didn't have body language, but they saw by his nonbody language, his humility. you always sensed he was surprised that all these people had shown up for me. people grabbed that. they realized that. and i think for that reason, they were also willing to listen to him. >> we see now, matt, of course, the helicopter that will take the pope to his place...
654
654
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
CNN
tv
eye 654
favorite 0
quote 0
ratzinger, and over the function of the vatican, he did such a masterful job that many people believed it propelled him to election as benedict xvi, there won't be those massive public events ahead of the conclave, the public performance during that period becomes much less important than the behind the scenes conversation that will go on as the cardinals of the world begin to gather here in rome. >> there will be speculation about who the current pope favors to be his success sore i imagine. >> benedict made it clear when he he talked about papal resignation in the past, he does not believe it would be appropriate, but people will try to read the tea leaves in terms of what benedict is thinking about this process may be. it should be said, one of the questions over the years, about a resigned pope, precisely this, the potential in the church, where one faction to the church loyal to the new pope and one faction loyal to the old pope, so the extent to which once the successor is named, how benedict can both symbolically and substantively see the passing of the torch, that he is no long
ratzinger, and over the function of the vatican, he did such a masterful job that many people believed it propelled him to election as benedict xvi, there won't be those massive public events ahead of the conclave, the public performance during that period becomes much less important than the behind the scenes conversation that will go on as the cardinals of the world begin to gather here in rome. >> there will be speculation about who the current pope favors to be his success sore i...
412
412
Feb 27, 2013
02/13
by
KNTV
tv
eye 412
favorite 0
quote 0
she wrote about her friend when he was just cardinal joseph ratzinger. >> john paul ii was much more vigorous. when he wanted something, he was really now! joseph ratzinger is not now, but is trying to convince -- maybe try to convince to make these people reasoning in a certain way, but he didn't succeed. >> reporter: even the most faithful say his legacy will be m mixed with great accolades for his teachings and writings but criticism for some of his leadership. >> success is hard to say. it's not that there's been highs and lows but issues to deal with that have been very serious. >> reporter: the abuse of children by priests has driven people away from the church. >> i think there are all kinds of rules and regulations that have been set up to protect children more so that this does not happen again. >> reporter: the growing consensus is that the next pope must be a strong manager, able to take on the challenges and reign in a dysfunction al. able to lead this institution and charisma never hurt. >> i hope he will be a man with a vision and can move forward. say to the crowd i lo
she wrote about her friend when he was just cardinal joseph ratzinger. >> john paul ii was much more vigorous. when he wanted something, he was really now! joseph ratzinger is not now, but is trying to convince -- maybe try to convince to make these people reasoning in a certain way, but he didn't succeed. >> reporter: even the most faithful say his legacy will be m mixed with great accolades for his teachings and writings but criticism for some of his leadership. >> success...
1,314
1.3K
Feb 27, 2013
02/13
by
FOXNEWSW
tv
eye 1,314
favorite 0
quote 0
ratzinger, the new pope, i was on the first plane to bavaria to do the story about this new man's life, this new pope's life. anyway, yes, it was emotional. we heard him speaking english, which was interesting because we're used to hearing him speak primarily in italian. it was clear from today's general audience, it was a different speech. normally it's a catechism. this was really a reflection on his decision and his thanks to the people who supported him and to the faithful who accepted his decision to step down from his post. very unusual moment and historic moment in that people generally don't get chance to say farewell to a pope. a pope passes on and then another one is elected. so this was a very special moment and he clearly was emotional and spoke about how his time as pope had been full of joy, but also full of difficult moments and i think we can read into that in many ways. but he said most importantly that they never felt alone, that he felt he was asked to do this job. he didn't seek it out. and he was guided the entire time. now the clock is ticking. this was his last p
ratzinger, the new pope, i was on the first plane to bavaria to do the story about this new man's life, this new pope's life. anyway, yes, it was emotional. we heard him speaking english, which was interesting because we're used to hearing him speak primarily in italian. it was clear from today's general audience, it was a different speech. normally it's a catechism. this was really a reflection on his decision and his thanks to the people who supported him and to the faithful who accepted his...
432
432
Feb 11, 2013
02/13
by
KNTV
tv
eye 432
favorite 0
quote 0
what has struck me in the 25 years i have known the man who will return to being joseph ratzinger, is the simplicity of his soul. this is a thoroughly convinced christian believer who happens to be one of the smartest people in the world who speaks six or seven languages with complete flewency, who knows the history of biblical religion from "a" to "z." who never wanted to be an executive, a manager, who always thought of himself primarily as a scholar. but who somehow could translate all of that learning into beautiful simplicities about god's love for the world and for god's people. >> and, george, even as we honor the service of this pope, we look forward to the election of a new pope. and tell us about this process. i mean, is this a sort of thing where, for lack of a better term, there are front-runners? >> there will be an enormous amount of ink spilled in the italian press over the next two weeks about front-runners. most of that would be silly. there are a number of cardinals who fit what would seem to me to be the profile. first of all, a man in full physical vigor. that sugg
what has struck me in the 25 years i have known the man who will return to being joseph ratzinger, is the simplicity of his soul. this is a thoroughly convinced christian believer who happens to be one of the smartest people in the world who speaks six or seven languages with complete flewency, who knows the history of biblical religion from "a" to "z." who never wanted to be an executive, a manager, who always thought of himself primarily as a scholar. but who somehow could...